The HUD specifications for swimming pools, hot tubs and spas are covered in Attachment 3 Lock Change/Securing Service Requirements, but the specifications give no details on how to secure a hot tub.

Additional information is given in part III Winterization of Attachment 7 Winterization Requirements And Cost Schedule: "All winterization should be performed in accordance with state and local codes, ordinances and regulations."

Lacking specific instructions from HUD, the M&M Contractor, or your client, the contractor may investigate local and state regulations and consult with local legal counsel.

One municipality ordinance provides this detail: " 'Secure Hot Tub' means a private outdoor hot tub, whirlpool, hydro massage pool or spa with a rigid lockable and tight fitting cover that will withstand human weight without collapse while not in use, and is enclosed within a minimum 4 foot high fence."
It appears that in order to secure a hot tub in this municipality, the securing service would have to be bid since it would be difficult to meet the municipal requirements for the HUD allowable of $55.

HUD will reimburse the mortgagee for debris disposal without a receipt. However, the mortgagee must supply the name, address and phone number of company removing the debris - this would be you, the contractor, - the FHA case number, the address of the property, the date of the debris disposal, the cubic yards of debris and a list of any items in the debris that are not ordinary household debris or items that are health hazards. Items such as tires, appliances, cars, trucks, batteries, boats must be itemized.

Since the above information is required from the mortgagee, the contractor will have to supply the information. None of this information supplies the contractor with knowledge of what the contractor must do to satisfy their clients. Your clients should have specific requirements of what to do when you cannot furnish a receipt and it would be best to have this information in advance of the actual need.

Hi Scott,

Your question comes up once in a while - probably because at one time or another you saw a list of key codes to be used in different parts of the country. They did exist at one time but things have changed.

HUD did not publish any key codes to be used on properties. Rumor had it that legal advisers recommended that key codes not be publicized. And, of course, things started flowing downhill. This put the burden on the M&M's to tell us all what to do.

The M&M's have a huge responsibility and many people to work with so they consulted with the National Companies and possibly others I am not aware of. This was an important step because it would effect real estate professionals, appraisers, property preservation crews, lenders, pest control companies, etc. As you know, property preservation personnel are not the only ones with access to and responsibilities to a vacant property. So, the M&M's decided they had to take all consequences into account. Some M&M's changed key codes and others did not - feeling there was too large an inventory of locks and keys in the field to make changes.

The decision on key codes continued to flow downhill and wound up with the lenders. The National Companies worked with the lenders, their clients, and basically did what the lender wanted. They pay the bills. The key code will depend on who the lender is, who the national is and who the M&M is. To insure that things are not too easy to figure out, there may be one key code for properties pre-conveyance and another post-conveyance.

Now, to answer your question. There is no key code for Michigan - or any other state for that matter. The key code to use should either be included in your work order or should be standardized by having been stated in training and information documents from each company and supplied to the contractor.

Questions like yours are the reason Cubic Yard exists. Thanks for asking.

Work with your clients to ensure you have clarity of key codes so you can stock what you need and offer superb service to your client while insuring the success of your property preservation business. You probably do not want to do like I did years ago and buy twelve cases of everything. Some of those cases have never been opened and others stay critically low. By the way, you can get more information at www.performancelocks.com.

Hi. Glad you found us. I would like to think your best information will be found here on Cubic Yard. The entire HUD guidelines is presented online and you can search for your particular interest.

I had a question earlier about key codes. Look through the questions and answers link to read my previous answer about key codes. HUD does not say which codes to use. That information should come from the company requesting the service. At Cubic Yard, search for "key codes" to find what information is in the HUD documents. Be sure to use the quotation marks.

Jacksonville has requirements unlike the rest of Florida. Search Cubic Yard with the word "Jacksonville", without the quotes, and the Jacksonville Florida requirements will be shown.

If you would like to see the original documents, HUD ML 2007-03 Cover Letter and Attachments is at www.hudclips.org

I hope this helps you. Good luck with your business and if you need additional information, please let us know.

An initial secure is a work order directing the contractor to preserve and protect the property from deteriorating or suffering any damages until conveyance.

Each company requesting an initial secure will have their own list of services which, when performed, satisfy an initial secure. The differences from one company to another are negligible but important to that company nonetheless. These services generally include:

lock change and lock box installation

removal of interior and exterior trash

boarding of damaged windows and/or doors

remove abandoned vehicles

cut grass, trim shrubs, edge lawn

broom sweep interior

winterize and or de-winterize as necessary

remove snow

take pictures

submit damage and condition report

HUD has not defined nor outlined the services required for an "initial secure". Therefore, the M&M or national servicing company will have to provide their own definition or outline of services. HUD has published a list of services it lists under the heading of "Minimum Securing Requirements". Search for the phrase "Minimum Securing Requirements" on Cubic Yard to see that information. Use the quotation marks.

The attributes a property has to have to be considered in conveyance condition can vary depending on who is calling the shots. For instance, if I am an investor and use a broker to find properties for me, I can require the broker to offer for my consideration only properties that are painted lavender. For me to consider the property in conveyance condition, it has to be lavender.

Since you are visiting Cubic Yard, I am going to have to assume that you are involved in property preservation in some way or another; and probably dealing with HUD properties. This will make it a little easier to answer your question. My answer will apply to HUD properties.

Let's start with conveyance condition. HUD requires:

• The property be undamaged by fire, flood, earthquake, tornado, hurricane, or boiler explosion.

• If conveyance is during grass cutting season, the grass must have been cut within two weeks of conveyance

• Mortgagees are to remove materials considered unhealthy or hazardous are to be removed prior to conveyance

There are further HUD conveyance condition requirements concerning roof damage, mold and fire insurance claims but whether these would be a condition for conveyance of any one property depends not on whether they exist or not, but rather when they occurred, when they were discovered and when they were reported.

Additional attributes are mandated by the M&M and they may vary a little from one area to the next but these property attributes usually are:

• The mortgage company has clear title to the property. This is usually accomplished as a result of the foreclosure sale

• The property is not occupied. If the property is occupied after the foreclosure sale, the mortgage company must go through eviction proceedings

• The property is secure and has been secured following the guideline requirements including lock codes

• Outbuildings are secure and have been secured following the guideline requirements including lock codes

• Boarding, if required, has been completed and was completed following the guideline requirements

• Pools, hot tubs, and/or spas are secure per the guideline requirements

• The property has been winterized per the guidelines

• Utilities have been transferred into the mortgagee's name, if required by the guidelines. This requirement depends on heating system type and regional variation

• If the property has a sump pump, the sump pump is functional and electricity is on and transferred into the mortgage company's name.

• Exterior debris and health hazards have been removed from the property per the guideline requirements

• Interior debris and health hazards have been removed from the property if guidelines for that area call for removal

• Personal property has been removed from the property per the guideline requirements

• Grass has been cut within two weeks of conveyance, if conveying during grass cut season

• The property is free from any damage, other than that due to mortgagor neglect/unfinished renovations, except for fire, water, freeze, flood, earthquake, tornado, hurricane, boiler explosion, vandalism, and roof damages.

• There are no outstanding property condition code violations or citations.

If any of the above listed is not completed, the property is not in convey condition. The only exception to these requirements occurs if HUD has been advised of an issue where the requirements have not been met and has agreed to accept the property as is.

Now, what loan types are affected? All mortgage plans can be divided into two categories - conventional and government loans. Any mortgage loan other than an FHA, VA or an RHS loan is a conventional loan. HUD properties will have government loans and here is a little information about the three types of loan types affected.

FHA Loans - The Federal Housing Administration (FHA), which is part of the U.S. Dept. of Housing and Urban Development (HUD), administers various mortgage loan programs. FHA loans have lower down payment requirements and are easier to qualify than conventional loans. FHA loans cannot exceed the statutory limit.

VA loans - VA loans are guaranteed by U.S. Dept. of Veterans Affairs. The guaranty allows veterans and service persons to obtain home loans with favorable loan terms, usually without a down payment. In addition, it is easier to qualify for a VA loan than a conventional loan. Lenders generally limit the maximum VA loan to $203,000. The U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs does not make loans, it guarantees loans made by lenders. VA determines your eligibility and, if you are qualified, VA will issue you a certificate of eligibility to be used in applying for a VA loan. VA-guaranteed loans are obtained by making application to private lending institutions.

RHS Loan Programs - The Rural Housing Service (RHS) of the U.S. Dept. of Agriculture guarantees loans for rural residents with minimal closing costs and no down payment.

Ginnie Mae which is part of HUD guarantees securities backed by pools of mortgage loans insured by these three federal agencies - FHA, or VA, or RHS. Securities are sold through financial institutions that trade government securities.

Some contractors are reluctant to ask their client what they consider conveyance condition for fear of appearing to lack experience. Most clients however, would really prefer you ask. Most have a check list for the contractor to go by. We have done hundreds of property preservation jobs and we go by our client checklist. Every time!

Everything I have written here can be made invalid by your client. If they require only that the property be lavender in color then that is all you will have to be concerned with. The client you are working for always has the final say.

The only book I am aware of is offered by the people that have www.sirs4quality.org. Look around their site and see if you can find the info on their manual. I hear that it is very good - a little pricey maybe - but very good.

I do not know if includes a glossary.

Hi Tim. I think I am answering a duplicate questions here. Look through the Q&A and you will find your answer.

Start by contacting the larger mortgage servicing companies. There are quite a few listed at www.TheRepReport.com. You may also be quite successful contacting local lenders and real estate brokers.

I do not know of any training available at this time other than one company that can possibly help. Contact me by email and I will put you in touch with them.

The first thing that comes to mind is CYA. Sump pumps have an important job to do and can only do their job if they are functional and have a steady supply of electricity. Know what your client wants you to do, document everything and make sure that pump works.

To be classified as a "unit", there must be a kitchen.

The fees shown are the maximum fees authorized by HUD. Any work that would cost more than the published authorized fees must be bid.

Contractors in the field normally have a percentage of their billed amount retained by the company that sent the job. This is known as the discount rate and can range from a low of around 10% to as high as the contractor can handle.

There are some companies that deal with their clients using HUD rates and deal with the contractors using another pay scale or possibly a flat rate per property.

So, to answer your questions: (1) Yes, most companies will retain a percentage of the total, and (2) the fee schedule is not what anyone is paid - it is the maximum allowable without bidding.

You've got me stumped on this one. I am familiar with pre-sale and post sale inspections but not pre-sale and post-sale loans. If anyone can help us on this one, please e-mail me.

I have e-mailed you some info.

Poking around all the normal sources for info revealed that most reps are happy with whatever they have. Also, it looks like by the time a recommendation is made, the particular model recommended is no longer in production.

The highest requirement I have for digital cameras in the field is the camera's speed. The second most important requirement for me is for a zoom lens. Third: batteries - what type, rechargeable, etc.

My last purchase of cameras surprised me. I shopped for the features I require and wound up with a camera from a lesser known manufacturer and it was the lowest priced camera on display. It works great.

There is no price guidelines from HUD for this type of work. Basically, your work order is directing you to do the work and send the bill. Your bid after the fact should be reasonable for both the quality of the carpet and the labor. Don't forget that most of us discount to the national so you will want to adjust your bid accordingly.

Some reps start by contacting national and regional servicers - you will find a good many of them listed at www.TheRepReport.com. Other reps start by working for local lenders and real estate brokers. There's no reason why you can't do both.

As they say, "Don't quit your day job". There is almost no basic information available. Remember, this business has always been a "secret society". Visit the Yahoo groups and Google groups and find an active group - then find someone in the group that seems willing to help. Other than that, you will find it here or at the HUD site. Go to The Rep Report and look at the web links; call companies listed there.

It is across the board for every different type of work including all work that you bid.

I know it's a hard decision to make. I'm sure most field contractors want to do a good job and are even willing to do a company a favor now and then but it has become a common practice for some companies to ask favors with no intention of acknowledging the favor in any way.

Contractors can probably get all the work they want if they are willing to work for free but it's hardly a way to make a living.

If the company has treated you fairly in the past or if you honestly feel you will be rewarded, go ahead and take a loss this time but I think you will position yourself much better within the industry if you do a good day's work for a good day's pay. That means that you ask a fair fee and see if they are willing to be fair - a lot of them are not.

HUD does not state any requirements for insurance; they publish only the work that is to be done, what the allowable fees are, some specifications of materials to use and a few procedures requirements. Pretty much everything else is a requirement of the M&M or the servicing company contracted by the M&M to arrange for the work to be done.

Each client you have will have their own requirements for insurance. Their insurance requirements may be passed down to them from the M&M or their insurance requirements may have originated in-house.

I am really not qualified to answer your question; I can only report on what I consistently see in the industry. Basically, the company you do the work for will tell you their insurance requirements and as a prudent business person you should talk to your legal advisor, your insurance agent and maybe even your tax expert. The requirements imposed on you from your clients may not be what your advisors would advise you to have. Don't skip this part - you really need to involve your legal advisor, your insurance agent and your tax advisor.

You will probably be required to have General Liability and E&O insurance. Some companies may require you prove participation in your state's Workmens' Compensation program. One item almost no one thinks about is legal insurance. Like everything else in the business world, a legal situation can arise at any time. I recommend a Pre-Paid Legal Plan. I recommend it enough that I have become an Independent Associate with them. Check out their plans at my associate site: www.prepaidlegal.com/biz/tplatt

The actual billing would be up to you but it is very simple. Contractors will bill an agreed to figure that may have come from a bid, a maximum allowable, or straight from the HUD pricing guidelines. The contractor will receive the billed amount minus the previously agreed discount.

I really have no way of knowing what the average income would be for a preservation contractor. I've heard everything imaginable.

I know one contractor here locally that was always on the verge of starvation and finally got out of the business. He never was too motivated though.

I've also heard yearly income figures that, although possible, sounded like the contractor was stating gross income, not net.

I recently talked with a contractor up in snow country. He stated that he reported a little over $65,000 income for 2007. He never is as busy as he would like. He also said that if the rest of 2008 keeps going like the first part of the year, he expects to double that this year. Again, I cannot verify any of these statements but I do believe this contractor.

Contact some of the companies listed in the web links at www.TheRepReport.com and ask to speak with the contractor recruiter for your state. You may also find involvement with local banks in your area.

Here's another answer not intended to make me sound like a smart aleck - I'm just stating the reality of the business.

Although the HUD regulations are pretty specific concerning "conveyance condition", those specifics are scattered around in the regulations. So, the answer to your question is: "The property is in conveyance condition when the company sending the work order says it is in conveyance condition".

Most companies can furnish you with a check list to go by when putting a property in conveyance condition - it should be in their "contractor guidelines handbook".

Use the search function and put in "conveyance condition". You will find that this question has been asked before and the answer has pretty good coverage of the topic.

I have e-mailed you some information on E&O insurance. The best company in my opinion would be one of the smaller companies. They do not have as much work as the larger companies so they take the time to do it right the first time. And, they return calls. And they don't push. And they listen.

I have hesitated in answering your question because I have given it a lot of thought. I even thought it would be a good idea to create such a checklist.

However, it never fails! If you had an entire hardware store with you, there is always at least one thing you need that you do not have.

I talk regularly with a contractor that has been in the business for twenty to thirty years and I pick up lots of good ideas from him. For instance, he does not carry carriage bolts for securing plywood to openings. Instead, he carries threaded rods and cuts it to length as needed and makes his own carriage bolts.

The further you are from a hardware store, the more important it is to have what you need on site. It's really painful to have to drive sixty miles to the closest store to pick up a tarp or a 2x4 but we all have done it.

The best advice I can give is to start making your own list. At every job, go over the list and make sure every tool or item you used at the job today is on the list. Eventually you will have a pretty inclusive list but I guarantee you one day you will not have something you need.

Sounds like your first job is going to be a real test of surviving in the property preservation business.

If you have had the opportunity to work with lumber for a while, you probably have discovered that a splice can be made stronger than the material it is made of; you probably have also learned that given a span too large, some materials cannot support even it's own weight.

But rules are rules. In order to protect yourself you must follow the specs or have permission to deviate from the specs. It appears you cannot follow the specs in this case; there's not that many 40' 2x6's around. Your only option is requesting authorization to deviate from the specs.

Rule number one is to take pride in what you are doing and do a superb job while protecting yourself legally and financially. As with any job, if you cannot fulfil the service requirement to spec and within the allowed fee, you will have to bid the job.

You may want to bid several different solutions one of which may include the cost of having special length lumber cut and delivered to the site. Under no circumstances should you "do it your way" without authorization and then proceed only if you feel good about the outcome which includes (1) the quality of your work, (2) pride in a job well done, (3) willingness to accept the liability and (4) a profit deposited in your bank account.

If you want access to some really good info about lumber, take a look at http://www.awc.org/technical/spantables/tutorial.htm.

The majority of contractors do not work directly for mortgage companies. Instead, they work for a servicing company that contracts with many mortgage companies. A lot of the servicing companies are listed at www.TheRepReport.com.

Other contractors have contacted local lenders such as local credit unions and smaller "home town" lenders and do work for them.

There is no reason you cannot work for both the nationals and locals. When you say "inspector" do you mean "inspections only" or are you meaning "inspecting and contracting"?

If your intent is to become more knowledgeable of the job, I do not think the property preservation training would do as well as self study of the HUD regs and experience in the field.

If you do not yet feel comfortable with your knowledge you can start by knowing the HUD regs inside and out and interpret and apply those regs to your own situation.

The ideal situation would be to find a company that would work with you on the training and experience aspect but that is not too likely to happen - most companies prefer you assume the position of experienced expert; that way, when things go terribly wrong they can sit back and say: "Hey, you're the expert". You know what I mean.

Another possiblity that actually does exists is to locate a mentor. There are a few individuals that are willing to help new contractors - not many, but a few.

I know of only one company that is pretty unique in the industry that specializes in helping preservation contractors for a fee. If you are interested, let me know, and I will forward the info to you.

As far as fees go, the HUD regulations are giving you the allowable costs for what can be called "the normal situation". You obviously cannot get the maximum fee for a ten minute job nor should you expect a payment of only the stated allowable costs for a unique situation.

Always put yourself in a position to make a profit or stay away from the job. When I say "profit", that is exactly what I mean. Pay yourself, pay your expenses and put a "profit" in the bank. If you do not do that, you have not created a business, you just have created yourself a job.

Once you get the ball rolling, you might consider additional training or certification but only to use as self-promotion.

Unfortunatly, right now, today, only a few companies acknowledge certification from Web Exam or anywhere else. All the companies are competing with each other and refuse to come together on training, testing or certification. They are soon to pay a very big price for their isolationism.

Best is like beauty, it's in the eye of the beholder. There are companies that some contractors swear by while others go out of their way to say how bad they are. It would be very smart to spend some time reading the archives of some of the Yahoo Groups and Google Groups that discuss property preservation. You can get a pretty good feel for which companies you would classify as good or bad.

When Is A Property In Conveyance Condition
To convey means to transfer the ownership of real property from one to another. The transfer uses legal documents such as a deed which records all the information about the transfer.

The most common use of the term property conveyance in the property preservation industry is when discussing or performing the services necessary to meet the HUD specifications for the condition of a property that is being transferred, or conveyed, to HUD.

HUD’s document: General Requirements For Preservation And Protection of Properties Securing FHA Insured Mortgages covers in detail the necessary procedures for property conveyance to HUD.
The attributes a property has to have to be considered in conveyance condition can vary depending on who is calling the shots. For instance, if I am an investor and use a broker to find properties for me, I can require the broker to offer for my consideration only properties that are painted lavender. For me to consider the property in conveyance condition, it has to be lavender.

Since you are visiting Cubic Yard, I am going to have to assume that you are involved in property preservation in some way or another; and probably dealing with HUD properties. This will make it a little easier to answer your question. My answer will apply to HUD properties.

Let’s start with conveyance condition. HUD requires:

• The property be undamaged by fire, flood, earthquake, tornado, hurricane, or boiler explosion.

• If conveyance is during grass cutting season, the grass must have been cut within two weeks of conveyance

• Mortgagees are to remove materials considered unhealthy or hazardous are to be removed prior to conveyance

There are further HUD conveyance condition requirements concerning roof damage, mold and fire insurance claims but whether these would be a condition for conveyance of any one property depends not on whether they exist or not, but rather when they occurred, when they were discovered and when they were reported.

Additional attributes are mandated by the M&M and they may vary a little from one area to the next but these property attributes usually are:

• The mortgage company has clear title to the property. This is usually accomplished as a result of the foreclosure sale

• The property is not occupied. If the property is occupied after the foreclosure sale, the mortgage company must go through eviction proceedings

• The property is secure and has been secured following the guideline requirements including lock codes

• Outbuildings are secure and have been secured following the guideline requirements including lock codes

• Boarding, if required, has been completed and was completed following the guideline requirements

• Pools, hot tubs, and/or spas are secure per the guideline requirements

• The property has been winterized per the guidelines

• Utilities have been transferred into the mortgagee’s name, if required by the guidelines. This requirement depends on heating system type and regional variation

• If the property has a sump pump, the sump pump is functional and electricity is on and transferred into the mortgage company’s name.

• Exterior debris and health hazards have been removed from the property per the guideline requirements

• Interior debris and health hazards have been removed from the property if guidelines for that area call for removal

• Personal property has been removed from the property per the guideline requirements

• Grass has been cut within two weeks of conveyance, if conveying during grass cut season

• The property is free from any damage, other than that due to mortgagor neglect/unfinished renovations, except for fire, water, freeze, flood, earthquake, tornado, hurricane, boiler explosion, vandalism, and roof damages.

• There are no outstanding property condition code violations or citations.

If any of the above listed is not completed, the property is not in convey condition. The only exception to these requirements occurs if HUD has been advised of an issue where the requirements have not been met and has agreed to accept the property as is.

Now, what loan types are affected? All mortgage plans can be divided into two categories - conventional and government loans. Any mortgage loan other than an FHA, VA or an RHS loan is a conventional loan. HUD properties will have government loans and here is a little information about the three types of loan types affected.

FHA Loans - The Federal Housing Administration (FHA), which is part of the U.S. Dept. of Housing and Urban Development (HUD), administers various mortgage loan programs. FHA loans have lower down payment requirements and are easier to qualify than conventional loans. FHA loans cannot exceed the statutory limit.

VA loans - VA loans are guaranteed by U.S. Dept. of Veterans Affairs. The guaranty allows veterans and service persons to obtain home loans with favorable loan terms, usually without a down payment. In addition, it is easier to qualify for a VA loan than a conventional loan. Lenders generally limit the maximum VA loan to $203,000. The U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs does not make loans, it guarantees loans made by lenders. VA determines your eligibility and, if you are qualified, VA will issue you a certificate of eligibility to be used in applying for a VA loan. VA-guaranteed loans are obtained by making application to private lending institutions.

RHS Loan Programs - The Rural Housing Service (RHS) of the U.S. Dept. of Agriculture guarantees loans for rural residents with minimal closing costs and no down payment.

Ginnie Mae which is part of HUD guarantees securities backed by pools of mortgage loans insured by these three federal agencies - FHA, or VA, or RHS. Securities are sold through financial institutions that trade government securities.

Some contractors are reluctant to ask their client what they consider conveyance condition for fear of appearing to lack experience. Most clients however, would really prefer you ask. Most have a check list for the contractor to go by. We have done hundreds of property preservation jobs and we go by our client checklist. Every time!

Everything I have written here can be made invalid by your client. If they require only that the property be lavender in color then that is all you will have to be concerned with. The client you are working for always has the final say.

Every company that a contractor may work for, may interpret the regulations a little different from their competition; or, they may add services to what they feel are the basic minimum services in order to distinguish themselves from their competitors.

HUD regulations state their minimum requirements for conveyance condition. Some of the minimum requirements will not be the responsibility of the contractor, such as ensuring that the mortgage company has clear title to the property.

The M&M responsible for the property as well as the servicing company sending work to contractors may additional requirements to the HUD minimum.

Contractors can be almost certain that all of the minimum requirements must be satisified and there will probably be additional items added by the M&M or the servicing company. The work order should be fairly specific as to what is to be done or make reference to the servicing company's contractors' manual which hopefully is more specific.

A unit is any portion of a property that has a kitchen. The best example of units is an aparment building. The apartment building is one property consisting of units. Another example is a single family residence with a mother-in-law suite out back: one property - two units.
The key is the kitchen. No kitchen, no unit.

The M&M normally has one or more real estate brokers that handle properties for that M&M. The realtor or property manager will go to the M&M for anything beyond their local authorization.

There is no number one best way to get into a locked house. It will always depend on the particular circumstances. Every contractor should try to become so good at entering locked properties that there is absolutely no damage to the property and leaving the property accessible by authorized personnel as the only indication work has been done.

First, check to make sure the doors and windows of the property are locked. Most contractors report that getting into 20 or 25 percent of the properties they visit are as simple as turning a door knob or raising a window.

Other methods to use may include bump keys, cylinder pulling, re-keying, drilling the lock and many others. Take these words of warning: Check with your legal advisor and local law enforcement to make sure possession of your tools is not illegal. Although we have work orders indicating that our activities are legal, possession of certain equipment may need licensing, permits or special identification.

Income from mortgage inspections work and income from property preservation services both vary greatly across the nation. HUD allowable fees for preservation services change from state to state and mortgage servicing companies vary their rates for inspections depending on population density, inspector competition and other factors.

Boy I do this a lot. It's in the e-mail.

You got it.

I'm sure the city of Chicago would like for you to have a business license. Maybe even your county and state. I advise you check with all of them and get any license required. That way when you are in need of their services, you've already paid the bill.

I once was confronted by a couple of policemen in a property we were working on. They were convinced of our legitimacy only when they checked with the business license office.

There's more good reasons for the licenses than there are bad reasons.

The key code will be dictated by the M&M or the company sending you the work order. There is no longer a HUD specified key code.

You just gotta put me in a situation, huh? My first question is has this ever happened before? The way things are going crazy now, you may be hearing the truth but that excuse has been used for a long time.

I cannot give legal advice but I am curious if the sub-contractor agreement says anything about you getting paid? You may find that the boss has already broken the agreement. If so you may have other options. Anybody in this business needs a legal advisor just for this type of situation.

Read the sub-contractor agreement again. Better yet have an attorney read it. Most of these agreements say you cannot place a lien on the property but if it that has been left out of the contract ...

What do I suggest? Take past experiences into consideration but get your money if at all possible. If not, move on and don't let it happen again. What goes around comes around.

Most contractors charge $20 to $30 for trip charge. It doesn’t matter much what you say, companies will tell you that you have to accept their normal fee which they will quote under whatever you say.

Keep in mind that if you give a low price on a trip charge some companies have a bad habit of using you to go do second estimates for work they have no intention of giving you. They have to have a second bid on some services in order to satisfy HUD regs.

If you will drive to the location, spend your time figuring up a bid and then go back and do the paperwork, all for $20 or $25 bucks, you will probably get a lot of experience doing second bids. Then you will be broke.

I have contacted the Texas Department of Revenue and am waiting on their response. When it comes, I will update this Q&A

You may want to check with your local banks, credit unions and other lenders. To find other companies that operate nationwide, look through the web links at www.TheRepReport.com. You can also search the internet using keywords and phrases like: "REO work", trashouts, "maid service", etc.

The info is on it's way.

The info should be in your in box by now.

It's in the mail.

HUD regulations, as stated in Attachment 5, are consistent in describing the amount of debris that can be approved without bidding: a one unit property: 12 cubic yards; a two unit property: 15 cubic yards; a three unit property: 18 cubic yards; a four unit property: 21 cubic yards.

The amount of debris in cubic yards is set the same in all states. What does vary, however, is the fee per cubic yard which is applied to the total property fees.

On CubicYard.us, go to your state page where you will find the particulars for your state.

National mortgage service companies cannot guarantee any volume of work so licensing and insurance expenses are encountered way before any income is seen. With this in mind, seek immediate generation of cash flow from companies other than national service companies.

There is not a standard trip charge. Most companies have a set fee that they pay for a trip charge.

Pre-sale and post-sale refer to the time before (pre-sale) and the time after (post-sale) a property is sold at a sheriff’s sale or at the time the property’s ownership is transferred from the homeowner to another by whatever means is required by local laws.

You don't need certification unless you intend to use the certification as an indicator of experience. At this time there is not any certification program accepted universally by all companies involved in the business.

A possible exception to needing certification is if you get a request from some company asking that you do so. If they do make this request, they should also be able to tell you what certification they will accept.

Use the contact info I am sending you.

I imagine the going rate for a locksmith is three to five times the HUD allowable - pretty much a good way to start losing money fast.

While filming a training video once, I accompanied a contractor that told me he could get in a house in less than 15 seconds and he did. And, he only caused about $200 in additional repair expenses. Later, he showed me how to get into a house with a monkey wrench and a crowbar. Such is the state of the industry at times - the low bidder gets the job.

Now, how should you be getting in to the houses? I recommend that you invest some time and just a little expense to learn how to use either bump keys or lock picks. I understand the electric lock picks do a good job although I have not used them. I use bump keys and have pretty good success. When all else fails, I drill the lock; it takes a lot more time but there is a lot of pride in getting into a house without a clue that you have done so.

There's a new sheriff in town - a lot of QC in the field. Finally! Take pride in getting into those properties without a scratch and clean up behind yourself. I guarantee you the word will get around about your quailty of work or lack thereof.

It's on the way.

It's on the way.

First of all, if you did find other companies in the area, I doubt very much you would learn much about their pricing.

Now, it is always very difficult to answer your type of question but if everyone would be honest with themselves, it would be quite easy to set the price for services. To stay in business you are going to have to make a profit. Put your experience to the test, get out pencil and paper, and figure to the best of your ability what price range you can do the work for.

Now, the most important part is to think about the other guy first. Sounds strange I know, but every successful business activity has to be a win-win situation for all parties involved. If not, then there is a loser that leaves; usually with hard feelings.

I have had the most success with business-like, friendly negotiation but you can do that only once you know how much it cost you to do a certain activity. You are then in a position to defend your request and also to know when you are negotiating with another win-win business person.

If you find that they are not willing to negotiate in a business-like, friendly manner, that is an indication that you are dealing with someone that is negotiating toward a "I win, you lose" situation. In that case, you are really stuck with a take it or leave it situation.

Wish I could be more help but a dose of reality is good once in a while.

A cubic yard is a cube 3 feet by 3 feet by 3 feet. Or it is a web site like www.CubicYard.us.

See http://www.cubicyard.us/PickupCapacities.pdf for examples of a cubic yard.

HUD does not require any type of license.

The second paragraph of the General Requirements section of the regulations states: “Generally, the more diligent a Mortgagee is in completing timely foreclosure and conveying a property, the lower the expenditure for preservation and protection will be. A Mortgagee may use any individual or firm to perform preservation and protection services on properties securing FHA-insured mortgages; however, the Mortgagee remains fully responsible to HUD for its actions and the actions of its agents. As a cautionary note, the Department reminds Mortgagees that in addition to the surcharges discussed in this Mortgagee Letter, HUD may pursue enforcement action, including debarment, civil money penalties and actions under the Program Fraud Civil Remedies Act.”

Some companies may like for the contractor to have a contractor's license, but it is not a HUD requirement. Companies asking for contractors to have a license may be trying to discourage you or they may be trying to get licensed contractors for their work for a number of reasons. Whatever their intent, the licensing requirement is theirs, not HUD's.

Workers’ Compensation laws vary from state to state. A very nice reference for all states’ workers compensation laws can be found at http://www.ic.nc.gov/ncic/pages/wcadmdir.htm

See Questions and Answers #38

The E&O info is on the way.

Thanks

The answer to this question is found in Attachment 3, Lock Changes and Securing Requirements which lists the minimum services required.

Sentence 2 states: “. Broken glass should be replaced, unless the opening is to be boarded. All broken glass should be removed.”
The beginning of Attachment 3 indicates these services “may be per-formed without prior approval from the M&M contractor if all individual expenses remain within the maximum cost allowable for that particular service. Written approval from the M&M contractor is required if the cost exceeds the maximum allowable for any particular service listed herein.”

Minimum Securing Requirement (Pre-Foreclosure)
1. At a minimum the Pre-foreclosure securing requirements should include the items listed in “I” above, except the rear entry door lock must not be changed to allow borrower access, if applicable.

The HUD spec you are looking for is the kind of stuff that is normally handled by the HUD contractors after HUD takes possession. Those specs are not included here but I do happen to know what you are looking for since we have worked with HUD in the past.

The number of steps is irrelevant; it's the height above ground for the first landing. I do not remember the exact figure, somewhere around 22 inches but a quick call to your local building inspection department will get you the answer. By the way, the call to the building inspection department is pretty smart anyway - local laws override HUD specs.

Attachment 5 covers debris removal. Starting with paragraph I. Exterior, here is the quote: "I. Exterior
Mortgagees should remove all exterior debris, including abandoned vehicles, in accordance with applicable local laws. Items of personal property that are securely affixed and in good condition, such as a swing set or dog-house/kennel should not be removed if they add value to the property. However, if personal property is in disrepair or determined to be a health and safety hazard, it should be removed."
So, yes is your answer for exterior debris as long as it is not affixed and in good condition.

Paragraph II covers interior debris and here is the quote "II. Interior (Including Attic, Basement, and Storage Spaces)
Mortgagees are not to remove interior debris except for:

• Debris that constitutes a health or safety hazard;

• Debris that has or is likely to result in issuance of a code violation, a fine and/or lien;

• Debris required to be removed as part of an eviction by local law enforcement or crews under the control and direction of local law enforcement where the Mortgagee has no control over the timing of removal.

If the clean out of a property’s interior is necessary, the clean-out should include removal and proper disposal of debris including:

• Shabby or torn carpet;

• Dilapidated, unsafe flooring;

• Health and safety hazards (See Hazardous Waste Removal, below), including dead animals; and personal effects (e.g., furniture, clothing, dishes, utensils), unless otherwise instructed by local law enforcement during an eviction."
Looks like this one is no; interior debris is not to be removed unless it falls into one of the exceptions.

Contractors are still stuck with trying to determine what is debris and what is personal property. Some good legal advice at the start of your business would be a good thing.

Tim, I have put some info on a new page titled "Insurance". Look for it.

The guidelines, in your case $45 per CY, is what HUD will reimburse without a fight. When working with mold and and any other hazards you should take into account the expenses of your safety equipment, vaccinations and disposal fees.

I've placed some info on a new page titled "Insurance". Check it out.

You are not alone - frustration is the new name of the game. Yes, many are dropping out but from my viewpoint there are two or three taking the place of every one that leaves.

You have to understand that: "No, HUD does not care". The idea of care, concern, etc., has always been introduced into this business but the sooner everyone realizes that these things are just wishful thinking the better they will be able to do their job. This is a business, and even with HUD it's the bottom line that matters.

It's going to boil down to one of two things. You will quit the business because you find no solutions to your problems, or you will realize that problems create opportunities. I've known both: contractors that go broke and contractors that do better than ever before.

Yes, the cost of materials is included so make sure you can do the job for the HUD fee or else bid the job.

Some companies now supply locks and pad locks - some for a fee, some free.

The E&O provider I recommend is nationwide so I am sending you that information. The property preservation software information is on it's way to you also.

See the other Q&A about licenses. HUD does not require any but you should have your city,county and state licenses as required. For those, call the city, county and state revenue offices.

Me too. I am sending you the one and only source I know of. I just found out today that the other source I had sold their software to a foreign concern.

There is no "property preservation" license. Agencies that have jurisdiction over business in your area will probably require a business license.

The info is on it's way to you.

HUD issued a Mortgagee Letter to clarify which Lock Codes, or Key Codes, to use. That letter left the designation of the codes up to the M&M responsible for the property. You can see the entire letter under the "Glossary" link on the main menu.

This question is so popular it has it's own dedicated page for an answer. Look under "Glossary" on the main menu. "Conveyance Condition" is in the list under the glossary.

The info is on it's way. Look in your in box!

I have e-mailed you the info.

You might want to contact Fidelity National Field Services and First American Field Services. These are two large nationals that first come to mind.

Unfortunatly there's not much help available yet. We have the HUD regulations available for download here and I think SIRS, www.sirs4quality.org, has some books and training but nothing else I know of other than some stuff being worked on at www.WebExam.us and www.PropertyPreservationTraining.com but none of it is finished.
How about going to the Yahoo Groups and Google Groups and find a property preservation group and listen in for a while. You can probably find a mentor. One of the older guys might take you under his wing so to speak.

The property preservation business is not much different from other businesses when it comes to finding clients. You will need to promote your business both locally and nationally. That means you need to let your local banks, realtors and insurance agents know what you do. A lot of contractors have good success bidding on services for their county and city governments.

I know property preservation contractors that do work for the sheriff's department, FBI, State Police, DEA, Coroner's Office and more.

Of course another way to get business is to just wait it out and be there. Many people get into the business for a quick buck and are soon gone. That makes their clients available. And, the big one - word of mouth. Yep, the companies will share some info between themselves - they will talk about you so keep that in mind and remember that quality service speaks for itself.

I remember those days. Every agent I called was completely lost and had no idea how to categorize the property preservation business. Fortunately a few forward-thinking agents saw the need and went about solving that need - there are only a few of them and I am sending you info separately by e-mail. Look in your in box.

Thank you very much. We enjoy keeping the site going and more good stuff is on the way. Look in your in box for the E&O information. Boy, it would be so much easier if the insurance agency would just pay for a bid ad!

Sort of reminds me of the school system that required all their teachers to have Masters Degrees and PhD's. Sure sounded good until they had close to 100 students in a classroom with no teachers. Seems the people with those degrees could make more money elsewhere.

Yes, some companies are asking for licensed contractors. Give it time. When they see what contractors charge things will swing back. Until then, either get the contractors license or find more reasonable companies to work for.

As far as licenses required, the answer is NONE. You will want to have the licenses your local governing authorites want you to have but you can read the HUD regulations for weeks and never find a requirement for any kind of license.

What you are experiencing now is one of three things: (1) the company wants to brag to their clients about having licensed contractors; (2) the company management is from another galaxy; or (3) the company wants to put as much of the burden as possible on your back.

It's a crazy business and you have to be quick on your feet - it may be time to look around a bit.
Your sidenote says that some of the contractors are not licensed. Now isn't that interesting!

We're working on the training guides. For software, get ahold of www.EastPointSystems.com

www.Insurance-Tek.com

HUD does not require any type of license.

The second paragraph of the General Requirements section of the regulations states: “Generally, the more diligent a Mortgagee is in completing timely foreclosure and convey-ing a property, the lower the expenditure for preservation and protection will be. A Mortgagee may use any individual or firm to perform preserva-tion and protection services on properties securing FHA-insured mortgages; however, the Mortgagee remains fully responsible to HUD for its actions and the actions of its agents. As a cautionary note, the Department reminds Mortgagees that in addition to the surcharges discussed in this Mortgagee Letter, HUD may pursue enforcement action, including debarment, civil money penalties and actions under the Program Fraud Civil Remedies Act.”

Companies asking for your contractor’s license may be trying to run you off by discouraging you or they may be trying to get licensed contractors for their work. Whatever their intent, the licensing issue is theirs, not HUD's.

The companies that you work for will tell you what they require. Then, be sure to check with all of your governing authoritites to see what they want. The company requirements and the state requirements do not mesh most of the time.

Uploading of data and pictures has become a full time job by itself. Several companies have gone into the business of uploading the reports and pictures - some here is the good ole USA and others elsewhere.

Seems like there is going to be a huge demand for it. Put together an ad and I will post it here.

For insurance check with www.Insurance-Tek.com. For software, check www.EastPointSystems.com

That's a very good question that has only one answer: the work property preservation contractors perform for national servicers. It is the general opinion of many contractors in the business that the national servicers require contractors to have the E&O insurance for the sole purpose of lessening their own total liablity. After all, if they can get the contractor to pay up, why should they?

HUD does not require any type of license.

The second paragraph of the General Requirements section of the regulations states: “Generally, the more diligent a Mortgagee is in completing timely foreclosure and convey-ing a property, the lower the expenditure for preservation and protection will be. A Mortgagee may use any individual or firm to perform preservation and protection services on properties securing FHA-insured mortgages; however, the Mortgagee remains fully responsible to HUD for its actions and the actions of its agents. As a cautionary note, the Department reminds Mortgagees that in addition to the surcharges discussed in this Mortgagee Letter, HUD may pursue enforcement action, including debarment, civil money penalties and actions under the Program Fraud Civil Remedies Act.”

Check out www.EastPointSystems.com

Can't send you a couple because I know of only one. Go to www.insurance-tek.com and check out their plans and their rates. Be sure to tell them they need to be advertising here!

A cube three feet by three feet by three feet or any shape with an equivalent volume.

There is almost nothing in the way of training. I have seen a few ads on the web but the only one I know anything about is offered by SIRS. Their web site is sirs4quality.org.

We are putting together some material for this site as well as www.webexam.us, www.propertypreservationtraining.com and www.fieldinspectortraining.com but they are all in the very early stages of development.

If you have any construction experience you probably will not have much trouble except for learning to follow the HUD regs which are not all that hard. When you need help, ask here or go to the Yahoo Groups and Google Groups; there are contractors on those groups that are usually glad to answer questions.

HUD does not require any type of license.

The second paragraph of the General Requirements section of the regulations states: “Generally, the more diligent a Mortgagee is in completing timely foreclosure and convey-ing a property, the lower the expenditure for preservation and protection will be. A Mortgagee may use any individual or firm to perform preserva-tion and protection services on properties securing FHA-insured mortgages; however, the Mortgagee remains fully responsible to HUD for its actions and the actions of its agents. As a cautionary note, the Department reminds Mortgagees that in addition to the surcharges discussed in this Mortgagee Letter, HUD may pursue enforcement action, including debarment, civil money penalties and actions under the Program Fraud Civil Remedies Act.”

That's not much work. Ohio has been beaten up pretty badly with the mortgage crisis thing. I suspect everybody and his brother in the p&p business moved to Ohio because of all the foreclosures. You're going to have a lot of competition. The very first thing you need to do is ask the company you do work for to send more work. Then contact other mortgage servicers and just talk; ask them what will get you their business.

Just basic tools that most people have around the house can get you started; drill, compressor, hand tools, lawnmower and so on. You have to have good reliable transportation and some way to haul debris. Possibly your largest expense to get started is going to be E&O and liability insurance - around 2,000 bucks or so.

Their cradle, your grave.

I am sending the insurance info separately. Your area is going to be very competitive; everybody wants Atlanta. I recommend you divide your efforts between the mortgage servicing companies and local companies. For the mortgage servicing companies, contact LPS, First American, etc. Locally, check with banks, realtors, insurance companies, etc.

HUD does not require any type of license.

The second paragraph of the General Requirements section of the regulations states: “Generally, the more diligent a Mortgagee is in completing timely foreclosure and convey-ing a property, the lower the expenditure for preservation and protection will be. A Mortgagee may use any individual or firm to perform preserva-tion and protection services on properties securing FHA-insured mortgages; however, the Mortgagee remains fully responsible to HUD for its actions and the actions of its agents.

As a cautionary note, the Department reminds Mortgagees that in addition to the surcharges discussed in this Mortgagee Letter, HUD may pursue enforcement action, including debarment, civil money penalties and actions under the Program Fraud Civil Remedies Act.”

Dawn, I have sent you some information on trip charges and discounts.

BPO: Broker Price Opinion
REO: Real Estate Owned

Look for separate e-mail.

The Secret Society! Your info is in your inbox.

Hi Dawn. Yep, when I went looking for E&O back when, my agent was confused too. Seems like everyone said we didn't need it and couldn't find it. It is not the same as a assurity bond. I'm sending you information that should help you. I know who you should talk to.

Attachment 4 of the HUD regulations specify requirements for the boarding of properties.

All boarding services are paid based on a unit of measurement called “united inch”. United inch is a common method of measuring framing. To deter-mine the united inch measurement of an opening, take the measurement in inches along one side of the opening and take the measurement in inches of an adjacent top or bottom. Add the two measurements to get a sum which is called the united inch or united inches.

HUD regulations also state that “the plywood used for windows will be cut to fit inside the concrete block or brick opening with a maximum 1/8” clearance”, so make your measurements at the edges of the opening.

The regulations also state the thickness of the plywood that is used for each type of opening: “Plywood thickness should be 1/2” for window openings, 5/8” for door openings and 3/4” for sliding door and French door openings. When extra large window openings are encountered use 5/8” or 3/4” as necessary”. There is a small chart in Attachment 4 that states the fee to be paid per running inch depending on the thickness of plywood used.

To determine the fee for each opening, multiply the running inches measure-ment times the fee paid determined by plywood thickness.

As an example let’s say we are boarding a window that measures 30 inches high and 20 inches wide. Adding 30 and 20 get 50 as our running inches.

The regulations told us to use ½ inch plywood for windows and the fee rate for ½ inch plywood is 0.80 or 80 cents per united inch.

Multiply the running inches measurement, 50, times the ½ inch plywood rate of .80 and we come up with 40 or $40 fee for this window.

There are many methods to determine vacancy and the HUD regulations specifically state these four in Attachment 2, paragraph I, sub-paragraph C:

(i) checking utility meters to determine if they are on
(ii) contacting the listing broker if there is a for sale or rent sign on the property
(iii) observing general maintenance and
(iv) speaking to neighbors.

Other methods may include surveillance, phone, cable, internet providers, mail delivery personnel, etc.

Attachment 5, paragraph III. Hazardous Waste Removal, states:

"Materials considered unhealthy or hazardous that should be removed prior to conveyance include but are not limited to:

• Decaying food or other organic matter;

• Dead animals and animal feces;

• Pest infestations (see below);

• Broken glass or other sharp objects;

• Large containers of liquids;

• Large quantities of paint or paint products;

• Paints or solvents in any amount stored in or near papers, fabrics or other flammable materials; and

• Highly flammable chemicals (e.g., solvents, paint thinners, gasoline, motor oil and motor additives, etc.)".

Sorry you overlooked it. Look at our top menu and find States A-I. You should find winterization dates for Idaho and other information about Idaho there.

I've never heard of that being done and the majority of taxing authorities treat labor (debris removal) as non-taxable. So, there are no HUD allowances or mandates. If you have to collect tax on labor in your locale, you will have to absorb the loss or bid enough to cover the extra overhead.

First, lets look at what must be done prior to the actual securing of the pool itself:

• Pump out pool leaving 4 feet of water in the deep end (this amount may vary depending on the elevation). After pumping, apply chlorine to control the algae in the remaining water. Circulate remaining water to mix chlorine. Isolate and drain pumps and filters. Remove all trash from interior of pool and haul away.

• If there is a pool cover present, secure and cover pool. Check with state and local codes to verify whether the pool should be fenced.

• If there are no jurisdictional requirements, and no existing pool cover, secure according to the diagram on page 20. However, no pool cover is required in Arizona, California, Hawaii, Nevada and Other Pacific Islands.

• Secure entrance gates to fences surrounding pools with a lock or padlock and chain when no lock is present.

• Replace any damaged or missing boards or sections of fence surrounding pools.

If the property has an above ground pool in good condition, built up with decking or other infrastructure that will support a pool cover, treat it as an in-ground pool. Above ground pools in poor condition or that cannot be secured in accordance with the guidelines herein, should be removed. If an above ground pool is removed, remediate any depression in the ground that might constitute a hazard.

Now for the fees:
Pool securing fees are $2.05 per square foot of swimming pool up to a maximum of $1,050.

Fees for securing or winterizing swimming pools and hot tubs or spas are not included in the maximum allowable limit per property. The costs for permits to drain pools/spas by local governments are included in the maximum limit for this cost item and will be reimbursed based on the actual cost incurred.

WARNING:
Check local area standards before draining pool. In areas where there is a high ground water level, removing too much water may cause pool uplift and damage the pool.

Use the search function on the front page to search for protecto, master, etc. There are several discussions about these.

I have re-installed the search function on the front page. Actually, I did not realize I had removed it. Anyway, do a search for conveyance and make yourself comfortable - there is a lot of information about conveyance condition.

The regulations state that one of the criteria for yard cut fees is the size of the lot is square feet so that may be required. Boarding of windows and doors are bid in combined inches which is a dimensions type computation. Some companies ask for the square footage of roof repairs. There are no hard rules that can answer your question but yard cuts, roof repairs and boarding are probably going to cover 99% of it.

You are correct. Some companies put their required discount rate in writing, for instance in their contract with the contractor. Other companies do not publicize their required/requested discount rates which requires the parties negotiate the rate usually before contracts are finalized.

What is the norm? There is none. Discount rates usually range 15% and up. Some companies have a sliding discount rate that grows larger for late jobs such as 15% normal, 20% done on time but reported one day late, 25% performed one day late and reported late, and so on.

And of course, you have the companies that charge a set discount rate and then trump up an excuse to charge back a payment. Watch out for these types - join the Yahoo Groups dedicated to property preservation and keep your ears open.

Attachment 6, paragraph 1, sub-paragraph A, states " Grass should typically be cut twice a month between April 1st and October 31st". There are no variations for Wisconsin stated at the end of the attachment so your answer is April 1st to October 31st.

Yes.

Rotten food, chemicals, mold and mildew, stagnant water, infestations.

Exposed electic wiring, leaking gas lines, holes in yard, low or nonexistent railing, etc.

Nothing. Absolutely nothing! Take a picture that helps verify that the house is occupied and document everything. Send an invoice for a trip charge and expect it to happen again.

I wish I had a video of the method I was shown years ago! It involved a crow-bar, a sledge hammer and a monkey wrench. He did get us in the house, though.

Hmmmm. Every situation is different. I would say the best answer is that you use whatever means necessary to enter the house without any visible signs that you have done so.

My brother can pick a lock or use a bump key and get in most places in less than 30 seconds. I usually have to drill the locks. Use titanium bits, by the way.

Really! Take a lot of pride in doing as little damage as possible. You will get more work, you will develop a good reputation and you will get far fewer busted knuckles. Don't be so foolish as to not check to see if the door is even locked. How about the windows?

Here's something you should know: In some places, possession of some of the tools of this trade is all that is required to be charged with a crime. Know the laws, have access to an attorney and memorize his/her phone number.

A cubic yard is 27 cubic feet which could be 3 feet by 3 feet by 3 feet, or 1 foot by 3 feet by 9 feet - or any combination that gives you twenty-seven cubic feet.

If you measure the debris in inches, one cubic yard is 46656 cubic inches. The typical washing machine is 26 inches by 26 inches by 42 inches which is 28392 cubic inches which is .60 (point six oh) cubic yards - just a little over one half cubic yard.

A full size sofa is around 26 inches by 36 inches by 86 inches which is 80496 cubic inches or 1.7 cubic yards.

Here's one more. A cubic yard can hold 202 US gallons or roughly four 55-gallon drums.

You're going to have to "eyeball" most debris but it's relatively easy if you visualize the pile as 55 gallon drums, washing machines or full size couches.

I have started a new debris removal service for precious metals. If you run across a cubic yard of platinum or gold, I will pick it up at no charge.

Never did hear back from them. I will try again.

The serial numbers also used to be scratched or welded on the frame immediately under the front door. I'm not sure if that is still done.

Manufactures are also required to place a placard containing all information about the home in one of the kitchen cabinets. Look on the back side of all kitchen cabinet doors and you will find one.

In the last couple of years, it has also become common for the manufacturer to place identification literature on the inside of the main electrical panel door. Not all do so, but enough to make it worthwhile to look there.

Hi Bill. Look in your email in box.

Most companies will include instructions with the work order on what to do in this case. This situation is very common - most homeowners will try to sell the place before it goes into foreclosure. In most instances contractors are instructed to proceed with the work as stated on the work order without removing or damaging the realtor's lockbox, if one is present.

I'm never reluctant to say that contractors should have a clear understanding with the company that sends your work orders. Written documentation is much better than "a clear understanding" too! Get the company rep to fax their instructions.

It's in the mail.

Well, you kind of got me stumped. There is no one answer for this situation - there are just too many variables. You really should be talking to a tax professional and a legal advisor.

You're right. Most of them do not know what we do. Call Vicki at www.Insurance-Tek.com. She can help you.

You are asking me to give legal advice which I am not able to do. My opinion though is in line with what others have always said "A verbal agreement is only worth the paper it's written on".

Be sure to maintain an open line of communication. You may want to get all of your brothers and five or six of your best friends and visit for afternoon tea.

You need a legal advisor. If you have none, you may want to look in your email in box. I have sent you some information.

You can find the original documents at the HUD website. That should give you a good preview; maybe enough to convince you that our English (non-government) version is much easier to use. Also, the HUD regs are the foundation for a large part of our training materials.

You could be "smart alec" and say "with a yard stick", or better yet how about "a cubic yard stick". Of course that may not get you any points. A cubic yard is a cube 3 feet by 3 feet by 3 feet. Some good examples can be found at http://www.cubicyard.us/PickupCapacities.pdf.

I think they are asking you to describe a cubic yard. Our training material is coming online soon. Hopefully some of it will help. By the way, give me a call.

Its in the mail.

The 2008 guidelines state (Attachment 3, paragraph III, Paragraph 2) state: "Pump out pool leaving 4 feet of water in the deep end (this amount may vary depending on the elevation).

You should pat yourself on the back for asking this question. At first glance, this appears to be an easily answered question case but swimming pool work can cost the inexperienced contractor some serious cash.

Notice the statement "this amount may vary depending on the elevation". The smart contractor should be curious about the word "vary" and ask "the elevation of what"?

The local water table is your primary concern. How far underground is the local water table? The natural water content of the soil in your area and the depth (elevation) of the water table work to push up or float the liner in a vinyl lined pool and work to penetrate the wall of other types of in-ground pools.

If you pump out too little water, you might find yourself defending against "not to spec" claims. However, on the other hand, if you pump out too much and the ground water floats the liner and/or causes a cave in of the earth walls, you will have a very expensive repair job.

Now that I've passed on the good news to you, I can say I don't know how much you need to drain an in-ground pool in the Miami Florida area. Your best bet would be to consult with a knowledgable and busy pool company. They normally can tell you what works in what neighborhoods.

Our pool securing training material will be online shortly. Be sure to check it out.

First, there is, to my knowledge, no required "property preservation license". HUD regulations do not give any requirements. You will, however, probably find your local licensing authorities will require some type of business license.

Also, it is almost standard procedure that your clients will require you complete some type of training. It may be online, by telephone or by mail.

If you are referring to "certification", again there are no required certifications at this time. Both the Society of Independent Representatives (www.sirs4quality.org) and Contractor Support Services (www.WebExam.us) have online testing for certification.

If it has a kitchen area, it is considered a unit. The regulations do not define "a unit" and I do not know how it came about that "if it has a kitchen, it is a unit".

Conficts come up with this definition however. HUD regs do state in the "General Requirements, Paragraph 1, titled 'Unit Pricing'" that "the maximum amount that will be reimbursed for all preservation and protection expenses on an individual property."

The problem is, an individual property may be a 50 unit apartment building. Another situation arises when a property has two or more water heaters and a possibly even a swimming pool heating system - no way all those can be winterized for the allowable.

It is always best to discuss this matter with your clients before they come up. Have them give you a clear definition of what they consider "a unit".

Thank you for the kind remarks. We're trying to do even more for the contractors in the field. We will have online training soon as well as some other exciting capabilities.

Hopefully the right firm or person will respond.

Use the search function on this site to look this up. Search for "Florida" and/or "pool". There's a lot more to this than just the HUD specs.

Why give them 25%? There are companies that will take advantage of you right up until you die from starvation. Then, they just call the next dummy on the list.

Don't work so cheap! If you're not making money you need to make some changes in a hurry.

I will send the insurance info. Carry your own water and a generator or arrange to pay a neighbor for use of theirs.

You're pretty much going to have to have insurance to even get work. Of course everyone should have their liability insurance from the get-go.

The problem in this business is the fact that some companies out there will tell you they will send work when you get insurance; then, when you get the insurance and contact them they are dumbstruck, deaf, dumb and blind.

If you're serious about getting in the business, get your insurance and take your chances with the rest of them.

Talk with the people at www.Insurance-Tek.com. I've found they know more about the business than a lot of contractors. My attorneys tell me to tell you that is not an endorsement!

My advice on getting started? Think twice about it and then read the yahoo groups about the business. Ask questions and don't believe everything you read or hear. Believe no one, not even me. Question everything. Document everything three times. Take hundres of pictures and hours of video - it's good to have in court. Have access to legal representation. Carry bug spray and get a tetanus shot.

Yep, you're missing a lot. The site for inspection info is www.TerryPlatt.com. Look it over and you will find that the going rate for inspections is no where near the HUD published prices. Inspectors are at the very bottom of the food chain - down in the mud.

Right here. Use the search function and search for "boarding" or go to #4 on the menu. Attachment #4 is all about board-up.

We use a variety of programming scripts that make a mess when asked to print our pages so we just disabled that option altogether.

The real meat of the site is the HUD regulations. We created a PDF file you can purchase and download if you like. We are also starting to make available for purchase some of our training material. You will see it publicized as it becomes available.

OK.

Which utility? Water, electricity, sewage, trash? You may find tags on meters or valves. Neighbors are a good resource too.

You may be lucky enough to get a map of each utility company's service area; most companies have them. If you do luck up and get these service area maps, you can always look to see if the property is located within the service area.

Most companies do not train contractors or vendors on how to do the job. It is common to receive a little training on the company's web site or paper work but not on the field work.

The IRS independent contractor test probably has a lot to do with the lack of training as does the burden of liability.

Unless you apply electricity to the sump pump, you are not going to know if the pump is working or not. Attachement 7 states " Where there is an existing sump pump used to keep basements or crawl space dry, the Mortgagee should leave the electricity on to assure the property is undamaged by flooding regardless of whether the property is located in a state where utilities are required to be off".

Somebody goofed. The servicer probably does not know there is a sump pump at the property. Notify them immediately and document everything. Keep your video camera batteries fully charged.

Attachment 7 states " Mortgagees should request prior written approval from the M&M contractor if the cost of installing a sump pump exceeds $250".

This would indicated the M&M, and hopefully the servicer does not need approval if you, the contractor, bid $250 or less for the installation. However, each servicer can have different requirements which will require that you bid the cost of installing a sump pump.

Check with the company that issued the property work order. I'm guessing that they will approve the job as long as you are within their requirements.

Bid to install garage doors and bid to board-up. See which one, if either, is approved. More than likely you will not get approval for either in which case the problem is solved.

The HUD specifications can not possibly cover everything, and this procedure is not covered. All I can give you as an answer is that the HUD procedures give pretty good coverage of boarding of doors. The regs even have good drawings. You will probably wind up adapting the shown door boarding instructions to the missing garage doors.

Talk with your company rep and ask if they have a "preferred method" for doing this - they have probably seen this a thousand times. One thing though that you must do for yourself: must do - must do- must do. Know what your local regulations are. Get to know the building inspectors in your area. It would be a shame to spend hours and possibly hundreds of dollars boarding up the garage and then get a fine or court appearance demand and have to tear it all out to boot!

There are no federal requirements that require a contractor's license. Your only concern should be with your state, county and city departments. The work we do is far less than that of general contractors, etc., so carefully describe what you do to the licensing authorities. Your license may fall into a "handy man" category or something similar.

You would not have much luck offering just these services alone to a national or even a regional field services company. They operate more or less on a "all or nothing" work order assignment basis. You would however have a better than average chance of performing these services as a sub-contractor to an existing contractor.

After a property is transferred to HUD, there is an ongoing maintenance schedule of services to the property performed by HUD contractors. The services you want to offer sounds just like the services they perform. To get more information on this, contact HUD’s M&M (Marketing & Management Contractor) for your state. Look for your states info page on www.CubicYard.us to get the M&M information.

Use the search function on the front page and look for "conveyance".

The only activities that are ever approved automatically are those that correct conditions to prevent or lessen life threatening or potential catastrophic damage. Leaking gas lines, busted water lines with running water, etc.

If you do anything without written authorization you probably will not get paid.

The initial inspection as well as the bid are not separated from the entire process. You will inspect and bid with the intent of having your bid approved and receiving a work order to proceed as in your bid. If you do not get approval, you have just donated your time for the inspection and bid.

The type or brand is not specified by HUD. The lock key codes are determined by the M&M or the company issuing the work order.

Stop. Do nothing. Bid the job and wait for instructions. If you do not have a work order authorizing exact work to be done you probably will not get paid or worse.

Sarah, sounds to me that you could do things a bit differently. You need to e-mail me and I will give you my opinion. I actually love to give my opinion.

One bit of opinion that I will spout off publicly is that no one, and I mean no one, should do anything at all in this business unless they have access to legal advise and legal representation. I can't say that some companies set out to take advantage of field reps, but it sure as h*** happens often.

Knowing your rights and defending your rights goes a long way towards business longevity. I'll look for your e-mail.

You will normally get paid 30 plus days after the job.

Most companies require you have all of the above. Some states may not require you to have the workers comp and hopefully you can obtain a statement from the state to that effect so you can present that in lieu of the actually workers comp certificate.

Take a look at attachment #7. The fee is set by HUD. You can bid the winterization fee if there is some reason you need to do so.

Use the search function and find the previous discussions on protecto locks.

It is impossible to create the list of preservation work required because every property is unique and HUD M&M's and their default servicers all interpret the HUD regulations a little differently.

You will have smooth sailing only when you understand the wording and intent of the regulations. Read "General Requirements For Preservation And Protection Of Properties Securing FHA Insured Mortgages". This is the very first part of the regulations - the general requirements. Pay close attention to paragraph III, "Conveyance of Damaged Properties". All of paragraph III is actually the "why we do all this" part of the regs. Then, the rest of the regs, attachements one through ten, are the "general outline of how we do it" part.

I guarantee you the companies you work for can supply you with their list of requirements that they go by to insure the property is in "conveyance condition". Get that list. Then, remember that the list is not written in stone; some companies change their own requirements when the wind blows from another direction.

The terms "pre-sale" and "post-sale" refer to points on the timeline of the property's history. Pre-sale is prior to the legal proceedings passing the property to a new owner other those we normally call the "homeowner". The legal proceeding is usually a sheriff's sale at the "courthouse steps" and the new owner often is the lender that held the mortgage on the property. Post-sale, of course, is anything after the sale.

That list could get rather long so let me say that if you read the first section of the HUD guidelines, you will find conditions that absolutely prevent conveyance to HUD. The company you are working for will have their own standards. Use the search function on the front page and look for "conveyance". You will find plenty of information.

The lock type is not determined by the state the property is in nor is it stated in the HUD regulations. Either the M&M for Kentucky hasset the standard or lets the servicing company set the lock code requirement. Ask your rep at the company what key code they need. Or, ask for the company's contractor guidelines to see what is in there. (Hope they have contractor guidelines.)

Attachment 3, paragraph 1, item 5 states, concerning secondary doors, "Other entryways that provide immediate access to the living area, attached garage or basement area should be secured with a slide bolt, unless otherwise noted in variations. Or, if the secondary entryway has an existing deadbolt lock, re-key the deadbolt to the specifications of the front and rear entry doors.

Attachment 3, paragraph 5, item 9, states "Detached garage doors and outbuildings should be secured with a padlock and hasp".

There are no variations for Kentucky in the HUD specifications.

It's in the email.

Every company is different. Some require an interior inspection along with the grass cut and some do not. It's really, really smart to document everything at every property every time! This includes lots of photos. Get the company to send their requirements in writing then take the time to cover your you know what every time. Every time. Some day you will be glad you did.

Trip fees are not specified in the HUD regs so most companies just set a fee saying they pay $25, $35, etc. Some try to get away with paying nothing. Some companies take their discount out of the trip fees and some don't - it all depends on the greed factor.

There's nothing like a simple, direct answer - wouldn't you say?

The exams are at www.WebExam.us

The size of the property has no relation to the volume of debris except, of course, a larger house can hold more junk.

There is no "official" way or simple way to come up with a figure of cubic yards. After a short while though, it is surprising just how accurate you can be just by picturing the debris "in your mind's eye". Just remember that a cubic yard measures three feet by three feet by three feet.

Most contractors find it is best to visualize the debris piled up in one big pile. Then visualize the pile as washing machines which are just shy of one cubic yard; or a full size sofa which is almost two cubic yards.

Look under "Reference" on the main menu, then choose "Links". You will find a link to a page that helps describe a cubic yard.

Before and after. Some companies require "during". That means a picture before you start on each item, a picture showing the anti-freeze going into the item, and a picture after the item is completely winterized. Why so many pictures? Because digital pictures are free. No film! Just ask any company's contractor manager.

No joking. Be smart. Take a wheelbarrow full and keep most of them for yourself - properly labeled and stored for easy retrieval. Why? Your documentation for your attorney. Ever thought about video too?

Every company is different. The HUD guidelines give some generic and broad recommendations but by and large every company interprets the regs a little differently. Do a search on this Q&A page. You will find lots and lots on that.

It's in the mail.

You specify the key code you want when you order your door locks. There is not much chance you will be able to find them locally. If you deal with a company specializing in serving our industry, they know all about key codes.

I will send you some more information by e-mail.

Yes, I can do that.

Specific fees for removal of paint per gallon are no longer in the HUD regulations. Looking at Attachment 5, paragraph III., the last full paragraph states that dried latex paint is treated as regular debris. Backing up in the same paragraph, the bulleted items state that "up to five gallons of paint and paint products" are considered not hazardous waste for purposes of debris removal.

No mention of oil based paint or speciality paints are mentioned.

For one gallon of latex paint, you may want to include it as normal debris on your bid for debris removal.

The companies you work for will dictate the coverage amounts. Talk with your insurance agent, your tax professional and your legal advisor to get their input. I am emailing the insurance info.

Neither the definition or description of personal properties is in the HUD regulations. A couple of examples of personal property are given in Attachement 5, Paragraph I: swing set, dog-house/kennel.

Every contractor's concern should be the definition or description used in the local jurisdiction. So, again, the wise business person will talk with a legal advisor to find out how to make the determination between personal property and debris. Some jurisdictions place a value per item; some for total of all items.

As an example: one contractor removed and disposed of ten wooden pallets found on the outside of a property. Debris, right? In court, the homeowner stated their salvage value was over the dollar amount the contractor used as the dividing line between debris and personal property. The contractor had to pay up!

Check with www.EastPointSystems.com. Ask for Tom Margarido and keep him on the phone for about 5 hours.

You wouldn't be making even $75.00. Don't forget your overhead: transportation, fax line, paper for the printer, insurance, etc.

You're not missing anything except that the published fees are the fees that will be readily approved. If you cannot do the job for the published fees, then bid the job at a rate per cubic yard that gives you the fee you need.

Pricing for this type of work is not covered under the HUD Regulations we work with. Check with a local contractor to find out what the going rate is for drywall repairs. This will give you a good starting point to determine what your bid should be.

The HUD Regulations state, in Attachment 5 "Mortgagee may expend up to the amount listed in this attachment for debris removal without prior written approval from the M&M contractor".

The last page of Attachment 5 is the "Debris Removal Service Schedule" which shows the max fee for debris removal and the allowable fee per cubic yard.

First determine what state the property is in. As an example, let's use New York and say the property is a one unit property.

Move over to the "Max 1 Unit" column and you will see it shows 12 cubic yards.
You can download Cubic Yard's PDF version of the schedule. Look under Free Contractor Help; then look under Downloads.

Find New York in the first column of the schedule

That's easy: The HUD regulations call for "a sufficient amount". It's up to you to determine what it will take to keep the pipes from freezing and woe to those who do not err on the safe side.

There are several. Safeguard Properties, Inc. has one; NAMFS has one and a lot of contractors like the Mortgage Bankers Association conferences. Check out the property preservation yahoo groups and ask around. You will find enough comments to help you decide when to stay home and when to go to a conference.

The M&M is responsible for the whole shebang. There is a lot of work that has to be done behind the scenes - legal work, title work, etc. There is a lot of work before we come on the scene and probably more after we are no longer involved. The M&M orchestrates all of this.

(1) Bid to remove the mold and clean the refrigerator
(2) Bid to remove and dispose of the refrigerator

Refrigerator, stove, dishwasher, HVAC system, washing machine, clothes dryer. The big stuff that's not put on the counter.

Each service has it's own fee schedule and that schedule changes from state to state. Lock changes are one fee, grass cuts another, boarding another, pool securing another and so on. By the way, it's NOT the maximum - it's the maximum that will be paid without requiring a bid. For instance: let's say in your state that HUD allows a door lock change fee of $40. If you are happy with the $40 then it's a done deal - do the job and invoice for $40. If the job is a $41 dollar job, you have to bid it at $41. If it is going to cost you $5500 to change the lock, you bid $5500.

You're probably missing the part about working for the right companies; better yet - work for none of them and get your work from smaller lenders and real estate brokers.

We have been in business long enough to have a steady crew that knows the business as well or better than we do. Needless to say we treat them like gold because they are the goldmine.

The same is true with our office help. We can get up and leave and everything keeps on going without us. Having a wonderful bunch of people gives us a little time for the sites which we would not have otherwise.

Our in-house database has over 5,000 property preservation contacts in it: contractors, inspectors, brokers, etc. We are able to call on most of them for information or work when needed. Even though we've been around for quite a while, we still don't know it all.

Do a search for different groups at groups.yahoo.com. It will take some time but you may find a gold mine. In fact, that's what you are doing - you're mining for information or prospecting. Search using words that are common within the industry or specialty. For instance, if you are interested in doing commercial inspections, you may want to search for:
"floor plan"
"leased equipment"
"underwriting"
"underwriters", etc.

You can even narrow it down a bit and search for groups that may be discussing"
"auto recovery"
"aircraft leasing"
"marine salvage"

I hope you get the idea. Snoop around and find out what's going on. I guarantee you the contractors that have found groups that give them leads will not be telling anyone about the groups.

I frequent these groups:
Insurance-And-Mortgage-Field-Services
InsuranceFieldInspectors
InsuranceInspections

PPR is the abbreviation for two terms used in the property preservation industry: (1) Property Preservation Report and (2) Property Portfolio Report.

REO is the abbreviation for "Real Estate Owned".

What is the difference? I have it from good authority that any answer that indicates knowledge of the terms the abbreviations stand for will be accepted.

Bam! Crunch! Zowie! Leaping bullfrogs, Batman!

Dear reader where have you been? I've been waiting for you to show up. Now here's somebody

I can relate to!

There are two things that easily stay in the top ratings of things I like the most: a nice

fresh scotch and soda on the rocks, and conversation with someone that just speaks their

mind. Well. I've got a nice fresh scotch and soda here next to the keyboard. Set down and

let's chat for a while.

I like to interact with people; particularly with people that like the same things that I

like, such as CubicYard. So I e-mail everyone that asks for information. The e-mail gives

me the opportunity to get to know these people. In a very short time, I can usually decide

if I am corresponding with someone I would like to know better. If so, I usually ask for

their phone number and permission to give them a call. There is plenty to talk about.

There's stuff about this business you will never see printed here or elsewhere. Well, I

take that back. I guess you may see some of it presented as evidence in court. So there's

your answer for the question about why I answer so many duplicate emails. Oh yea, another

reason: I think it shows I care.

By the way, I did recently post the insurance information online. It's under Sponsors.

Look for InsuranceTek, Inc. However, you are mostly right about the keycode thing.

Keycodes are not dictated by the regs so they are set by the M&M and/or the company sending

the work to the field.

Taking the time to send the e-mails is one of the things that makes the site work. I think

it gives a little personal touch.

I know looking through all that Q&A stuff can be frustrating but there is a reason for

publishing all the questions, even duplicates, all the time; and the same old answer time

and time again. It is something that I will discuss only after someone has made a very

generous offer for the site and signs a non-disclosure agreement. Sorry, but I can't

discuss it. Again, to your credit, however, you have pointed out a tremendous opportunity

for me to improve the site. I thank you very much and want you to be the first to know that

I started working on it within minutes of reading your question. You will see the results

shortly.

The answer to question #202 is: 35453 is nothing more than a code describing the form and

function of the tumblers in a lock. Neither you or I need to know more than that. When you

order your locks, you will specify what key codes you want. Most contractors keep a variety

on hand but stock mainly what their clients normally ask for. At Digital Field Services and

BamaREO we keep 32541, 67767 and a couple of others. So that's it: contractors install

plain ole door locks that look like all the others in the neighborhood; they just have a key

code that is shared with the contractor, the M&M, HUD, Realtors, REO contractors, etc. It's

like knowing the password to get into the speak easy.

Glad you like the site. I'm glad you're here. I hope you see now that there is some logic

to all this stuff. I really appreciate you taking the time to be so direct. It's sad how

few people are like that anymore. Hey, if it's okay, I'd like to talk sometime. If that's

okay, please email your phone number and recommend a good time of day to call. See? I like

you already.

Real Estate Owned, a term used by lenders to identify the type of asset shown on the company's books.

Water lines shared between to living units or even two or more fixtures in the same unit are common water lines.

Attachment 6, Grass Cuts, specifies at the bottom of the “Yard Maintenance Cost Schedule” states: “If property yard is over 15,000 square feet, contact the M&M contractor”

They are probably refering to the certification exam at www.WebExam.us

Two answers are correct:
(1) Property Preservation Report
(2) Property Portfolio Report

There are two answers for that. Both are correct. I know, because I called them!

(1) Property Portfolio Report
(2) Property Preservation Report

CubicYard.us is a service of Gulf Thunder Corporation and Terry Platt. The intent of the site is to offer news, opportunities and training for property preservation contractors.

Association? Now there's an idea!